Skip to main content

Breaking Fellowship — A Rant

Once again:
"So flee youthful passions and pursue righteousness, faith, love, and peace, along with those who call on the Lord from a pure heart. Have nothing to do with foolish, ignorant controversies; you know that they breed quarrels. And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth, and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, after being captured by him to do his will."
2 Tim. 2.22-26, ESV

by Cowboy Bob Sorensen

Most of the time, I try to keep these articles instructive and/or practical. This time, I am making the article a personal thing because I am hurt and angry. (Plus, some instructive and/or practical bits.) At the risk of sounding pretentiously noble, my "hurt" was not from personal attacks. Rather, I am hurting because of the way Christians act.

A while ago, I wrote that Christians get judgmental and will, in essence, slap down and break fellowship with a believer who is not "spiritual" enough to please them. My suggestion was that we can give instruction to the other believer (Gal. 6.1 NKJV).

There are times, however, when we are to distance ourselves and even break fellowship with some people who call themselves Christians (1 Cor. 5.11, 2 Thes. 3.14). If they repent, they should be restored (2 Cor. 2.6-8 NIV, Gal. 6.1 ESV). There is no need in this article to go into all of the reasons for breaking fellowship or putting someone out of the church.

One of the most frequent problems in the church is strife. (And "infighting", more than discussing areas of disagreement, is one of the reasons I left the faith for several years.) I have had some specific problems with the Calvinist-Arminian strife. Yes, I said strife! I have mentioned how I am bothered by the attitudes of some Calvinists who act like they have the One True Faith. But I have recently encountered some positively vicious attitudes among Arminians. Ironically, some say that they are attracted to the teachings of Jacobus Arminius because they seem kinder or gentler. His "disciples" that I have encountered lately are anything but kind and gentle! The main problems I have seen involve the Arminians’ dislike of the Calvinist position of "election" or "predestination".

Now I have a problem. I can try to give extensive documentation and, I feel, become part of the problem, or I can tell people to take me at my word (or do their own research), taking the risk that I will be called a liar. Fine, call me a liar if you wish. I have to go with Scripture and my conscience.

My recent encounters with Arminians have been quite startling, because they are acting like atheists. That's right, I said it!
  • Mockery, such as this unconscionable poster
  • Straw Man arguments, making caricatures of Calvinism to knock down
  • Selective citing and misquotes
  • Misattribution
  • Guilt by association; Calvin believed and taught thus and so, and he had certain character flaws. I heard a caller to Matt Slick on CARM radio ask him if he believed in something. He said, "No". The caller replied that John Calvin taught that. Matt replied, "Well, Calvin was wrong, then". News flash: Calvinists do not treat the writings of Calvin as if they were Scripture!
  • Hate and rage; "You're right to criticize Calvinism (not its people) — It's sickening!" Tell me, how far is it from "poking at the god of Calvinism" (through mockery and disunderstanding) to mocking and hating other believers in Christ? I feel that soon, this will turn into actual hatred of Calvinists themselves
  • Idolatry; "My God doesn't..." This includes putting preferences, feelings and opinions above the Word of God
  • Excusing and justifying themselves
Let me stop right here and point out that not all of the Arminians approved of the discussion, and there were some other voices of reason to point out the errors of the angry Arminians. I posted a few comments, and posted a link to a pertinent article (which I believe only had two visits, so they were not exactly interested). Also, I have a strong feeling that these Arminians do not trust God!

Not only are these angry Arminians attacking fellow Christians, they are unwilling to listen to others who pointed out flaws in their logic. Just like modern atheists who are only interested in showing off their uninformed opinions rather than actually understanding the concepts involved (Prov. 18.2), they compare notes with other angry people who lack proper understanding. Then, they justify their strident, hateful comments and positions.

It would be nice if more Christians would try to get the attention of these angry mockers and attempt to correct them. Also, all mature Christians can pray for them.

Do you know what this is, really? It is pride! It really looks like they would rather be "right" than to express Christian love. I really cannot get over how their prideful attitudes remind me of so many of the obstreperous atheists that I have encountered!

One of these people on Facebook wants to be an apologist. With his emotional bias and unwillingness to learn about what he is attacking, I think he will end up humiliating himself and the name of Christ.
Infighting among Christians is a source of derision for unbelievers, and a stumbling block for believers. When some professing Christians insist on causing strife, breaking of fellowship may result.
Listen, I am not a Calvinist. Nor am I an Arminian. I have agreements with both camps, and have problems with both camps. But I cannot stand for such contempt for fellow believers. So, instead of continuing to try to point out that these Christians are acting in a most un-Christian manner (and, frankly, making me wonder if they really are Christians in the first place, John 13.35, Luke 6.44), I cannot continue to fellowship with people who promote pride, strife and division in the body of Christ. Not until they repent.

What do you think? Am I right? Am I wrong?

There are things in the Bible that I do not like. For example, I wish that everyone could be saved and go to Heaven. So, I could take me "theology" even further than certain Arminians wish to go and become a Universalist. Also, I do not like the concept that some people are "elected" or "predestined" for salvation. Personally, I do not think this doctrine is correct (stumper: Acts 13.48), but I am open to the possibility that I may be wrong. I am not going to mock other Christians who hold to this view, because their view is based on Scripture, whether I agree with their understanding of Scripture or not.

And there are other things in the Bible that I do not like. Why? Probably because I do not understand them. We, the created beings, cannot fully comprehend the Creator! That there are things in the Bible that we do not like, or do not understand, does not make them untrue. Nor does it give us any right to ridicule those who hold to a position that we disagree with.

In a comments area on a Facebook posting, I asked some of these people if they obtained their information from informed Calvinists, and I named a few examples. I was told, "I've had Calvinists themselves tell me this." So? Does that mean that those people were skilled and informed about the theology that they espouse?

I listened to a series of lectures on Roman Catholicism, and the lecturer said that we were probably better informed about the official teachings of Rome than the overwhelming majority of Catholics. Many times, I have heard Mormon callers to radio shows (or read commenters on articles) dispute what was quoted by the experts because they were uninformed about official Mormon teachings. The same with Mohammedans who say, "The Koran does not say this!" Uh, yes it does, here is the reference. And so on.

So, if you're going to criticize the doctrines, be very certain that you are understanding it correctly! Even with my lack of knowledge of Calvinistic teachings, I still caught the angry Arminians in significant errors.

Please, for the sake of Christ, we need to stop being so outright vicious to each other. Unless were are not truly his followers (John 13.35).


Todd Pitner said…
I submit one of Satan's greatest weopans is to create strife amongst Christians over non-essentials. So you believe that Jesus Christ is Lord and Savior? Do you believe that He was sent by God the Father on a rescue mission to right a fallen creation by living a PERFECTLY HOLY life that a Calvanist, Armenian or unbeliever never could? Do you believe He ministered, did miracles as prophesied, declared Himseld God, predicted His death, burial and resurrection...then suffered and died FOR our sins, IN our place, AS our substitute so that we could ultimately become reconciled with a HOLY JUST God? Do you believe that if you come to the awareness that you fall short as a sinner and in humility are sorrowful for your sinning AGAINST GOD and are grateful of His "taking one for the team" and committing the ultimate unfair trading practice -- exchanging all HIS goodness for all YOUR you RECEIVE His self-sacrifice as good and true? If you do, God bless(ed) you. Welcome to the Kingdom of God! Stop arguing the non-essentials...GO TELL PEOPLE THE GOOD NEWS! Jesus is ALIVE! He's a REAL PERSON WHO CAN BE FOUND!

He'll let you catch Him if you authentically seek Him.


People's eternal existence depends on them HEARING the GREAT NEWS!, STOP, the Name of Jesus...STOP arguing with other Christians and GO fulfill the Great Commission!

For the LOVE OF GOD, please!!!

In Christ,

Thanks so much, Todd! Well spoken.

The main point of this Weblog is to help followers of Jesus focus on the Great Commission, and to stop allowing ourselves to be distracted by the world, the sinful nature and the devil.

Your entreaty was an excellent conclusion to the article.
Tim said…
First, I agree many people do get quite heated and we should check our passions to see if they be godly or sinful. Fighting for truth however is one aspect of Christianity we are called too. some people don't like it. In fact, they hate it. Carnal warfare sometimes takes place in the physical war via government for the good of the people to defend them. The same is true in the Church. It may appear ugly and unloving to some, but it is for the good of the people of God. Personally I don't mind the term Calvinist as I understand it is short for a set of doctrines, but the thing is, I didn't learn them from Calvin but from the Scriptures. In fact, I didn't even know there was such a thing as reformed theology when I learned the doctrines. I was in a Church that didn't teach them and my Father was a SBC pastor who didn't teach them, so no one can claim I'm following man on that. I believe the doctrines of grace to be true and when I read or hear someone attack them, I defend that truth. If people are upset over that so be it. I love the Lord and I love people and my love for both compels me to speak the truth.

The Great Commission was to "teach ALL things Christ commanded" and that implies all the laws, love, and doctrines he espoused.

BTW, I would be concerned with the idol at the bottom of the page as it is a clear violation of the 2nd commandment. However, i'm guessing there will be many who think I'm just being devisive over that.
If you EVER leave advertising for your self-serving, self-righteous material again, your comment will not be allowed. By the way, I see you took out a Blogger ID. Was it just for the sake of commenting on this post? For that kind of behavior, use OpenID for more flexibility.

So, you think it's OK to divide the body of Christ, violate the commands that he gave us because you are "right" and others are "wrong" in your interpretations of Scriptures, labels are helpful and not hurtful, am I reading you right?

"Calvinism IS the Gospel", just the title is highly offensive to me, since you are putting your group on a pedestal as the sole arbiter of truth.

I strongly suggest that you examine yourself for pride, and re-read the Scriptures contained in this article.

By the way, you would not be "divisive" if that was indeed an "idol" at the bottom of the page. That was a petty remark. Interesting, none of the other Christians who read this site have complained.
KarinaTexan said…
Hey I subscribe to Creation Moments. I seen your blog info and I want to compliment you on the great way you express yourself. I come from a mixed religious background of Catholic,Protestant,Mormon,and Pantheist(American Indian).I was into various forms of the Occult for 13 years before I was set free from my deceiver by the grace of G_D. I have very little knowledge of Calvinism. I had two friends years ago that were bitter enemies though they were both Christians. One was from Ireland and one was from Scotland. One was Protestant,and the other was Catholic. I worked with them as a nurse in the hospital where I worked and I could not for the life of understand how two Christians that believed the Jesus Christ was G_D incarnate had such strong words to say to each other.entsis

Popular posts from this blog

Andy Stanley, Frank Turek, and Bad Theology

by Cowboy Bob Sorensen Andy Stanley has been disappointing some people, and causing quite a few to be alarmed by his opposition to the authority of Scripture. (Note: Do not be confused.  Charles  Stanley is his father, senior pastor of First Baptist Church in Atlanta, Georgia, and heard on In Touch Ministries . I've found most of his teachings to be doctrinally sound, and he upholds the inerrancy and authority of the Bible.) Unfortunately, megachurch director Andy Stanley has been saying things that are destructive to the truth, including recommending the false teaching of theistic evolution. Gray wolf image credit: US National Park Service While shooting from the hip can be a good thing, someone claiming the title of pastor should reign himself in . Stanley was disrespectful of small churches, then apologized later . In another instance, " What  did he just say?", Stanley may have used a very bad word in a sermon. When the segment was legally posted on YouTube

Disappointment with Young Earth Creation

by Cowboy Bob Sorensen  First, a note for anyone who is curious. The usual format: introduction with some of my thoughts plus links for useful information, excerpts of featured articles, then links to keep reading. I put my name on it and call it an article when I have more to say. This one will be different. I will reference older articles, then add some thoughts that I hope will prove helpful. There is more following the excerpt and link. So, does anyone remember Ken Keathley? Medal image manufactured at Custom Medal Maker Several years ago, Ken Keathley renounced young earth creationism to accept an old earth view. Apparently, he was disappointed by people in the young earth community. No kidding? Taking Friendly Fire This is where I'm going to open up and get personal with both of my readers. Ken Keathley is not the only one who has been disappointed, and in addition, I've been deeply hurt by the young earth community. Things I have posted on social(ist) media have been &qu

Evaluating Truth Claims in Genesis

Some people try to dismiss Genesis as myth containing spiritual truth using elements from the pagan neighbors of the Hebrews. Others say it is misunderstood, as if the Creator of the universe was unable to communicate with us. With closer inspection, we see that Genesis is a historical narrative. Credit: RGBStock /  Billy Frank Alexander The idea that the early chapters of Genesis are mythological should not be accepted by professing Christians, as there are serious problems that result. (One of these is that Jesus, Peter, Paul, and others referred to these chapters as literal history, so by denying this, one is calling them liars!) Also, there are repercussions with the gospel message. Read some classical mythology, then come back to Genesis and see the difference. Myths are vague and have a different flow, but the Bible is precise. Indeed, even the sequence of creation days is specific — a day itself is defined. Interestingly, many translations have in Genesis 1:5 less accurate by us